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オシムに、この質問をしたのは誰だ!

川本暢のブログ版「フットボールのアフォリズム」 第二回

オシムに、この質問をしたのは誰だ!

「オシムの言葉」を楽しむためには、オシムと質問者とのリアルなやり取りを窺い知ることも一つの方法だ。だから、共同記者会見で誰がどんな質問をオシムにしたのかを知るのは、楽しみを膨らませる材料になると思う。質問者が誰であるのかを知っていて会見記事を読んでみると、よりリアルにその場の空気が伝わってくるだろう。

監督会見で語られた内容は、インターネット上ですぐに知ることができる。日本代表対ペルー戦後のオシムの会見は、『J's GOAL』『スポーツナビ』にアップされている。   

僕は、4月25日発売の『スポルティーバ』に原稿を書くために、試合後の記者会見に出席した。以下で、質問者とその内容を『スポーツナビ』から借用する。オシムの返答は、同サイトで確認されたい。

質問者:司会者
--試合の総括をお願いします。
オシム「印象として肉でも魚でもない。あまりよくないという意味だ...。」

質問者:川本暢
--ペルーにチャンスらしいチャンスがなかったということだが、それはペルー側に問題があったのか、それとも日本の守備がしっかりしていたからか?
オシム「両方だ...。」

質問者:川本暢
--もちろん日本代表をいちファンの視点として見ていたが、ペルー側の視点も持つことはあまり問題にならないと思う。
オシム「私はこの結果に満足していない...。」

質問者:川本暢
--では後半のプレーが良かったというのは、具体的にどの部分だったのか。
オシム「2-0になって、若い3人のプレーヤを投入してから...。」

質問者:東京スポーツ記者
--前半、ペルーが元気だったとき、なかなか日本が前線にボールを出せない時間帯が続いたのはなぜだと思うか。
オシム「質問の中に答えが隠されている...。」

質問者:浅野賀一氏(フリーランス)
--中村俊輔が特定のマークを持たず、相手が5バックの一番右の選手がフリーになっていて、後半そこから攻められるような場面が見られたが。
オシム「中村俊輔が弱点を持っていたということか...。」

質問者:石川とら氏(フリーランス)
--高原についてはどういう評価か。
オシム「試合の始まった直後はかなり苦労していた...。」

質問者:田村修一氏(フリーランス)
--試合の中ではタメを作ったり、テンポを遅らせることも必要だと思うが、そうしたバランスについてはどう考えているのか。
オシム「ここはサッカー学校ではない...。」

質問者:講談社記者
--自分たちの力を示したい選手がいたとおっしゃっていたが、そういうことを気をつけるように試合前に伝えなかったのか。
オシム「試合前に何か一言二言伝えたら、選手は変わるというのだろうか...。」

質問者:講談社記者
--中村俊輔のことを言ったのではない。焦りからミスをしないように精神的なケアを試合前にしないで、試合後に「負けていたかもしれない」と言うのはどうかと思ったのだが。
オシム「試合前のミーティングで何を話したかといえば、何も話さなかった...。」

質問者:杉山茂樹氏(フリーランス)
--エスプリを見せた3人の選手たちは、今後出場時間は増えていくのか?
オシム「若い選手というのはよくない。若い選手がいないのは、もっとよくない...。」

さて、オシムが会見の冒頭で語った、この試合は印象として「肉でも魚でもない(1)」という表現があちこちのメディアで取り上げられている。この言葉には、どんな意味があるのだろうか。欧州の人は、何かの事柄を説明する時に、料理や食事を譬え話によく使う。肉や魚料理は、フルコースの中のメインディッシュとして登場する。オシムが言う「肉でも魚でもない」とは、それがメインディッシュではない、という意味だ。つまり、メインではないのだから、あの試合は料理で言えば「前菜」だった、と述べているのだ。人は、いくら美味しい前菜であっても、前菜ばかりを食べさせられたら、決して満足することはない。なぜならば、肉や魚のメインディッシュがどれだけ美味しいのかを、人は知ってしまっているからだ。オシムが考えるベストな試合運びとペルー戦の代表の試合運びには、「メインディッシュ」と「前菜」ほどの開きがあるようだ。だから、オシムは「試合には満足していない」と話すのである。

オシムの記者会見は、独特の雰囲気があると『スポルティーバ』のI編集者から聞かされていた。確かに、実際の会見に出席してみると、質問者の自分とオシムが、禅問答をしているような感覚があった。『スポルティーバ』に原稿を書こうとしている今の僕は、オシムという師僧に返答する雲水(2)のような境地にいる。

川本暢(kawamoto.mi@gmail.com)
 
(1) 「肉でも魚でもない」という慣用句は、日本語で言えば「煮ても焼いても食えない」と同義。
(2) 雲がどことさだめなく行き、水が流れてやまないように、諸国を修行して歩く禅僧。

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